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a quick break to talk about McDonald's, you can't go wrong. Welcome

1:03

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1:08

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1:10

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1:12

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1:15

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1:32

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And Colonel, that's enough of the B

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around, grab a chair, grab a beer.

2:59

Let's talk some true crime. Family

3:33

is everything. When

3:35

times get tough, there is

3:37

nothing like having supportive parental figures

3:40

to help guide you to adulthood.

3:43

In the life of Clyde, a Jean

3:45

Delaney that figure was undoubtedly

3:48

her parental grandmother, Nancy

3:51

Warren. In

3:53

the absence of steady committed

3:55

biological parents, Nancy offered

3:58

her granddaughter a stable

4:00

upbringing and a loving household.

4:03

Not only when she became unexpectedly

4:05

pregnant when she was just a

4:07

teenager, but long after

4:10

even when Klyda was an adult

4:12

with three children of her own.

4:15

Which is why the horrifying events

4:18

that occurred in the dark, rainy

4:20

hours on the night of

4:22

Sunday, October 13th, 1968 were

4:26

all the more tragic. This

4:30

is True Crime Garage, and

4:32

this is the still unsolved case

4:35

of the bedside murders. The

4:52

following is told from the perspective of Johnny

4:54

Ussrey. I knew I was

4:56

late, waking that morning because I could see

4:58

that the sun was shining through my bedroom

5:01

window. Normally when I wake,

5:03

it is still mostly dark out, but

5:05

that morning the sun was already up

5:07

and out, and that normally

5:09

hasn't happened yet when I wake up. I

5:12

got out of bed and I went out of my room,

5:15

looking for my mother. So

5:17

I walked into my mother's bedroom and I

5:19

immediately noticed that her bed was still made.

5:22

I thought that this was weird because to me

5:25

it meant that nobody had slept in the bed.

5:28

My mother's purse was open and sitting on

5:30

the bed, the contents of which had

5:32

been dumped out, not in a pile

5:35

but spread throughout all over my mother's

5:37

bed. Of course, none of

5:39

this made any sense. The sun

5:41

shining through my window, my mom's bed

5:43

still made from the night before, and

5:45

her purse dumped. I

5:48

wasn't sure what was going on, or frankly

5:50

what I was supposed to do. So

5:53

I decided to go outside. I was still

5:55

in my pajamas and barefoot, but I went

5:57

outside anyway. I was looking for my

5:59

mom. My grandmother lived in

6:01

her trailer by herself right next door

6:03

My mother me and my two little

6:06

brothers lived in a separate trailer We

6:09

always went over there to my grandma's for meals

6:11

and to hang out and stuff There

6:14

was a gravel walkway between our trailer

6:16

and my grandmother's trailer When

6:18

I stepped outside right away. I saw my

6:20

mom She was lying

6:22

on the gravel between the two trailers. She

6:25

wasn't moving. I Ran to

6:27

her and knelt down Something

6:30

was around her neck. I

6:32

screamed I screamed as loud as

6:34

I could but it was of no use Not

6:37

to her not to me. She was

6:39

gone the thing about that moment that I'll

6:41

never forget is that my mom she

6:45

was a blonde a true blonde almost

6:47

platinum and Lying there

6:49

with no life left in her. She looked

6:51

different to me Her face

6:53

was so pale that it was

6:55

almost the exact same color as her

6:57

hair the same color as

7:00

her almost white hair She

7:02

my mom was all white

7:04

and she was dead. I

7:06

can remember it like it was yesterday I

7:09

screamed like crazy and I got up and

7:11

I ran to my grandmother's trailer Now

7:14

in this exact moment, I don't know

7:16

if I was still screaming or not

7:19

But I can remember watching my hand

7:21

twist the doorknob and it

7:23

opened with ease. I Pulled

7:26

the door open and I stepped inside. The first

7:28

thing that I noticed was that the television was

7:31

on but the screen was all

7:33

fuzzy Then I

7:35

saw her lying there the

7:37

same way as my mom I Was

7:39

frightened so I ran out of there But I

7:41

couldn't stand the thought of seeing my mother again

7:44

the way she was So

7:46

I decided to run out of the

7:48

back of my grandmother's trailer and

7:50

then I ran around to the back of ours I

7:53

went inside and I woke up my two brothers. I

7:56

dressed them both as quick as I could I

7:59

Was going to to get them out of there. We

8:01

were just about to leave when something stopped me.

8:04

I will never understand why, but something

8:06

compelled me to stop and grab the

8:09

three piggy banks that we

8:11

kept on top of the refrigerator. I

8:13

handed one to each of my brothers and

8:15

now with a piggy bank in each of

8:18

our arms, we ran the three

8:20

of us to the neighbor's house. Me

8:23

being the oldest, I pounded on the door. When

8:25

the neighbor opened up, I told

8:27

them that my mommy and my grandma

8:29

were dead. A short time

8:32

later, I remember staring out

8:34

the window, looking across the

8:36

field at the two trailers and

8:38

seeing all of the cop cars. I

8:41

was eight years old. Captain, these

8:43

murders as described by the little

8:45

eight year old boy, Johnny

8:47

Usry, are

8:49

at times referred to as the

8:51

bedside murders. Now from the description

8:54

that we just provided, that's

8:56

not such a great name. Mrs.

8:59

Clyda Delaney, age 24, this

9:02

is Johnny's mother. She

9:05

was found dead having been strangled,

9:08

just as he described, lying on some

9:10

gravel in the short distance between

9:13

these two trailers. Nancy

9:15

Warren, who Johnny is calling

9:17

grandma in this description, she

9:20

is 65 years old and

9:23

she's actually Clyda's grandmother.

9:25

So Johnny's great grandmother, but

9:27

he called her grandma. She,

9:29

Nancy, was found in the

9:31

living room area of her

9:33

trailer. She too

9:35

strangled, but there was a significant

9:37

amount of blood around her. She

9:40

was found lying in a pool of her own

9:42

blood. And in some reports, they state that this

9:45

pool of blood is about four

9:47

feet in diameter. This took

9:49

place near Ukiah, California. The

9:52

bodies were found on Monday, October 14th,

9:55

1968. That

9:58

is why the little boy was- saying

10:00

that he knew that he was late

10:02

because this was a school day for

10:04

him. And he was used to his

10:07

mother waking him for school as

10:09

we just heard. And that did

10:11

not happen on this day. So if

10:13

the bedside murders, isn't a good name,

10:15

where did it come from? And

10:17

what do you think it should have been

10:19

called? Well, I don't have an opinion on

10:22

what it should be called, but they neither

10:24

victim was found in their bed or next

10:26

to their bed. One victim outside one in

10:28

the living room, but we can

10:31

surmise here, captain, that the, the

10:34

name likely comes from the

10:36

original newspaper headline about this

10:38

story. And that headline

10:40

was Yukiah mother and daughter found

10:42

strangled in their beds, which we

10:44

know wasn't true. Now, keep

10:47

in mind back then and a lot

10:49

of the different parts of our

10:51

country, the newspaper newspaper

10:53

business was huge. And

10:55

sadly if that's not the case anymore,

10:58

the newspaper business was so

11:00

big and so many people bought

11:02

papers and red papers that they in many

11:04

parts of the country, they were putting out

11:07

a morning paper and an evening paper. And

11:10

we've seen this with a lot of other

11:12

cases from the fifties and sixties that

11:14

we've talked about over the years,

11:16

where you get this reporting there.

11:18

They're really wanting to get the

11:21

story out, but they, they don't

11:23

really have all of the information or

11:25

the information that they get is just not

11:27

good information because it's a rush to get

11:29

this story out, right? These bodies are found

11:32

7 30 AM, maybe

11:35

8 AM at the latest. By the

11:37

time we have authorities on the

11:39

scene and going through the scene and this

11:42

is in the evening paper, which still has to

11:45

be an article written

11:47

statement taken. And then

11:49

the paper printed and delivered to everybody.

11:52

So a quick turnaround would lead to

11:54

this being called the bedside murders with

11:57

the detail, the

12:00

image, incorrect detail of the two being

12:02

found strangled in their beds. William,

12:05

we have to remember too that newspapers

12:07

were a lot bigger because a lot

12:09

of households didn't even have television sets.

12:11

Now little Johnny had just turned eight

12:14

years old. This was just days prior.

12:17

So in many of the reports, he

12:19

is said to be seven. This

12:23

is Mendocino County, California.

12:26

Persons who follow this show will

12:28

remember that this is the same

12:30

general area that we were talking

12:32

about with parts

12:34

of the duo serial killers

12:36

case, Leonard Lake and Charles

12:39

Aang, but obviously years before

12:41

those abductions and murders began.

12:44

Now we need to go through a little

12:46

bit of a background

12:48

here on our victims. Nancy

12:51

Warren, the older of the two

12:53

victims, the grandmother or great grandmother,

12:56

she's Clyde as grandmother and

12:58

the great grandmother of the three boys that

13:00

were forced to flee the trailer on that

13:03

fateful day. Now, when most

13:05

people think of great grandmothers or great

13:07

grandparents, they think of persons in their

13:09

eighties or maybe their nineties. Nancy, by

13:11

all accounts was 64 or 65 years

13:13

old. She

13:17

was the owner operator of

13:19

Nancy's antique shop. Some

13:21

reports say that it was called Warren's antique

13:23

shop, which would be her last name. This

13:26

is located, this little store,

13:28

this antique shop was located

13:31

near the two trailers. That's

13:33

going to make things complicated for

13:36

investigators as well, because

13:38

there's the motive in this

13:41

case here, captain, for

13:44

either of these victims to have been killed is

13:47

still highly debatable to

13:49

this very day. One thing we have

13:51

to keep in mind too, that antique

13:53

shop that she owned

13:56

and ran. This

13:58

is very near highway one. We've

14:01

talked about this with bank cases or anytime

14:03

we have a victim where their home is

14:05

very near the freeway, that

14:07

lends itself to being maybe

14:10

a random crime. Somebody

14:13

driving by somebody from the area or

14:15

not even from the area. And

14:18

so this case gets

14:20

complicated just by the proximity to

14:23

the highway as well. The descriptions I

14:25

found state that

14:28

this antique store was approximately

14:31

two to 300 yards from the freeway. So

14:35

it's very close, not far at all.

14:38

Now, Nancy Warren,

14:41

the older of the two victims, she

14:43

was the owner of both of the trailers

14:45

that the family was living in at the

14:47

time. Nancy's in

14:49

one trailer and Klyda and the

14:51

three little boys in the other.

14:54

Klyda, who as reported has the

14:56

last name of Delaney. She

14:58

would have been just 16 or 17

15:00

when she had her first son,

15:02

Johnny, Johnny. And the other

15:05

two little boys, their

15:07

father is John usry. He

15:09

had done some prison time for

15:12

stealing cattle. And

15:15

at the time of these murders was living

15:17

in Oregon. So he's living in a different

15:19

state. The two

15:21

had divorced and I believe it was

15:23

just about two years before the murder

15:25

that they, they had separated and the

15:27

divorce was final. But it

15:30

should be noted that he

15:32

was seeking full custody of the three

15:34

boys, but wasn't having any

15:38

success on that front.

15:40

My guess would be him having committed

15:42

a crime that lands his butt in

15:45

prison is probably standing in the

15:47

way of him having full custody. Of

15:50

his three sons from

15:52

what little information there is the marriage

15:55

was not great, so the

15:57

two separated, but the boys were

15:59

very. And I can't

16:01

express this enough, very fond of their father

16:04

saying that it was like Christmas every time that

16:06

he came around. They always say

16:08

that they were very excited

16:10

to see him. So I'm guessing

16:13

that meant that when

16:15

dad showed up, when he was

16:17

around, when they got to see him, that meant

16:19

probably gifts. He's probably showing up with some gifts.

16:22

And I would have to guess too, given the

16:24

distance between them and

16:26

their father, the visits were probably

16:28

few and far between. And we

16:31

all know how much little kids

16:33

would look forward to a visit

16:36

of mom or dad, especially when

16:39

it's not so frequent. Investigators

16:41

got their hands full on this case because like you said,

16:43

you have the business not

16:46

far from where they live. So then it

16:48

becomes a question of, is this a

16:50

personal attack? Is this attack

16:54

connected to the business in some way,

16:56

shape, or form? And then when you're

16:58

doing your investigation, what is

17:00

missing? Is there anything missing from the

17:03

homes or the business? And the other

17:05

thing too that we need to go

17:07

through here is that based

17:09

off of his description, right? We'll,

17:12

we'll know more details as we go along,

17:14

but just based off of a little Johnny's

17:16

description, we know that the

17:18

killer or killers, I want to be clear about

17:20

that because there was a lot of thought that this

17:23

was at least a two

17:25

person job. The killer

17:27

or killers, we can surmise

17:29

from his description that they

17:31

entered both trailers, right?

17:34

They had to go into Nancy Warren's

17:36

trailer. She was found dead inside her

17:38

trailer. Now Klyda was

17:40

killed and found lying

17:43

between the two trailers. But

17:45

the little boy says that his mother's

17:48

purse had been dumped and scattered about

17:51

on her still made bed. And

17:54

so that would be indicative to me

17:56

that the person was

17:59

inside that trailer. trailer at some

18:01

point. Now the antique shop itself,

18:03

while it is very close in

18:05

proximity to these two trailers, was

18:08

never entered that night. And

18:10

that's a statement coming from not

18:12

family, not anybody that has anything

18:14

to hide. That's coming from law

18:16

enforcement. They say that the antique

18:18

store, nobody went into that store

18:21

during the time of the murders. Back

18:23

to the background here, Captain, it

18:26

looks to me like the

18:29

father, John, that they were so

18:31

fond of the three boys. I believed,

18:33

I believe he did raise the

18:36

three boys after Clyde was

18:38

killed. So that that's

18:40

going to be very problematic for him

18:43

as a suspect, right? It's widely known

18:45

at the time that he's

18:47

seeking full custody of

18:49

these three kids, not having

18:51

any success on that

18:53

front, but the result of the

18:56

murder is he ends up with custody

18:58

of his three children. Yeah. And it makes

19:00

you wonder, what was the court saying to

19:03

him to

19:05

begin with? Were they saying even if

19:07

she wasn't around, the custody would go

19:09

to the grandma. So

19:12

then that would be motivation to

19:14

kill both individuals. True. I

19:17

would imagine that they're probably not even worried about

19:19

next to kin when he's

19:21

filing and trying to get and seeking

19:23

full custody because the simple

19:26

answer is going to be you

19:28

went to prison. Here's this

19:30

woman, the mother, the biological mother of

19:32

these three kids, she's more fit, deemed

19:35

to be more fit by the courts

19:37

to raise them than you are. And

19:39

we all know that dollars to

19:41

donuts, especially back in the day,

19:44

a lot of times, even if

19:46

you're standing on even ground, the

19:49

mother may get majority custody. I

19:51

wouldn't say full custody, but majority

19:53

custody. Now we do know that

19:55

he was able to see his

19:58

sons. Now, did that mean? overnight visits.

20:00

Did that mean longer stays

20:02

at his place? That I can't speak to.

20:05

But what I can say is that after

20:07

this divorce, remember this is about two years

20:09

prior to the murders, Nancy,

20:12

our other victim, Klyta's

20:15

grandmother, we should point out the

20:17

Klyta's biological mother, which

20:19

would, which would be Nancy's daughter

20:22

was pretty much absent for

20:24

most of Klyta's life,

20:27

especially her adult life. So Nancy,

20:30

the grandmother insisted that Klyta and

20:32

the boys live in

20:34

the other trailer. I would

20:36

imagine she says for as long as you need, but

20:38

at some point, you know, this is an older woman.

20:41

This is a lot of responsibility that she's

20:43

taking on. We do

20:45

know that Klyta was dating maybe even

20:47

recently married to another

20:50

guy. This is Donald Delaney. So

20:52

that's the explanation for why her

20:54

last name is Klyta

20:56

Delaney at the time. Donald

20:59

is in his forties. He

21:01

has a daughter. She is in,

21:04

she's a young teenager at the

21:06

time of the murders. His

21:08

daughter lived with him. So

21:10

the two live in an apartment. The

21:12

marriage, let's just

21:15

say is debatable because we have

21:17

some say that they were married

21:20

and others say that there was no official

21:23

marriage license, but it could

21:25

very well be that she was married. But

21:27

what we do know is that she's

21:30

using his last name and after

21:32

the murders take place, the newspapers

21:34

are saying that the two were

21:36

married. Now, as this

21:38

story goes, Captain Donald, who

21:41

was more than 20 years older than

21:43

Klyta, the two were, were dating and

21:45

she gets pregnant. It

21:48

was said that the two went to Reno,

21:50

Nevada to get married. Just the two of

21:52

them at the insistence

21:54

of some of Klyta's family

21:57

members. Why weren't

21:59

the. to living together? Well, that

22:02

could be a very important piece of

22:04

the murder puzzle here. Donald said

22:06

that they would all five of them

22:09

be living together. If he could afford

22:12

to get a house big enough for

22:14

this new family, he

22:16

said that he was in the process of

22:18

house hunting, according to

22:20

some and according to others,

22:23

he said he simply could not afford

22:25

a house big enough for the

22:27

family. Donald was a

22:30

California highway patrol officer. So

22:33

they lived separate, but would hang

22:36

out together frequently. Clyde was

22:38

eight months pregnant when

22:40

she was murdered. So more

22:42

fittingly, so we should call this

22:44

a triple murder case because regardless

22:46

of who the killer is and

22:48

regardless of how this whole thing

22:50

went down at that

22:53

point, you have to know that

22:55

you are killing as soon to

22:57

be mother carrying a baby. Yeah.

22:59

Even though the business trailer wasn't

23:01

entered, that doesn't mean that that

23:04

wasn't a connection in this attack.

23:07

But then you have this pregnant

23:10

woman, which she's married or not

23:12

married. Rachel says they're together.

23:14

Ross says they're on a break. Do

23:16

we have any sign of sexual assault?

23:20

Cause that could be a possible motive

23:22

in this crime. We have no sexual

23:24

assault on either of the two families.

23:28

Yeah. With

23:41

big wireless providers, what you see

23:43

is never what you get. Somewhere

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27:18

Now, the call came into the sheriff's office

27:20

just after 7.30 a.m. that morning after little

27:26

Johnny found both mom and great grandma

27:29

dead and packed up his little brothers

27:31

and headed to the neighbor's house. Sheriff

27:35

Reno Bartolome and

27:37

a cadre of officers arrived on

27:39

the scene and began the investigation.

27:42

Sheriff Bartolome labeled the

27:44

case top priority. The

27:46

reports are that he assigned his

27:49

top man, this is senior investigator

27:51

Earl Friend, to the case.

27:56

This particular area.

28:00

they do have, so when

28:02

we say senior investigator, our

28:04

top man, he does have

28:06

plenty of homicide investigation experience,

28:09

but they don't, this

28:11

is not an area where they have dozens

28:13

of homicides every year.

28:16

From my understanding, it's

28:18

roughly one, maybe

28:20

two a year. So

28:22

not an area that sees a lot

28:25

of this type of violence or this

28:27

level of violence, we should say. Both

28:31

women had been beaten and strangled with

28:33

a leather boot lace. Now,

28:36

before we venture too far along,

28:40

this report, the reporting in this

28:42

case kind of drove me a little

28:44

man. The truth is both

28:47

women were strangled with a leather, what

28:49

I would describe as a leather boot

28:52

lace. Several

28:54

of the reports say that they were garroted

28:57

with a leather

29:00

thong. And

29:02

so to me, the word thong is much

29:04

different than a boot lace and garroted is

29:06

much different than strangled. To me, when I

29:09

look at a case and I see strangled,

29:11

it's kind of pardon

29:13

the term, but murder 101, right? Most people kill

29:18

someone for

29:21

just a very limited number

29:24

of reasons, either greed, revenge, hate

29:29

or anger, or to cover

29:31

up another crime. And

29:33

that's what gets wonky here because

29:36

we have two victims. There's a

29:38

strong likelihood here that one victim

29:41

was killed simply because

29:44

the other one was killed collateral

29:46

damage. Garroted to me

29:48

is very far from murder

29:50

101. That is sexual

29:53

sadism. That's a

29:56

whole different monster. The newspapers

29:58

at the time appear to

30:00

be using the word garat

30:03

and strangle interchangeably.

30:06

And they're not, it's

30:09

an incorrect statement. Okay? Like where

30:11

with a garat, you're now, you're

30:13

using another tool. You're

30:15

using some kind of tool. Usually

30:18

it's like a stick or sometimes

30:20

a branch or something

30:22

of that nature, maybe even a pipe to

30:25

use, to twist and to turn to, to

30:28

cause that strangulation with

30:30

that tool. And I say

30:32

sexual sadism because a lot of times when

30:34

this type of method is used, they

30:37

are, are releasing

30:39

and then tightening and

30:41

releasing and tightening to

30:44

cause maximum suffrage.

30:46

But as far as do we have

30:48

this murder weapon, was this murder weapon

30:50

left at the scene

30:52

of the crime? Both were found with the, with

30:54

an item still wrapped around their neck. Right.

30:57

So does that

30:59

to you, does that point

31:02

to more than one individual? Because

31:04

seems a little strange to me that they'd have,

31:07

they both have something wrapped

31:09

around their neck. Well, what seems the

31:11

most strange to me is that the way that

31:13

it's described is that both, both

31:15

items were left at

31:17

the scene, left around the necks of

31:20

the women and they, the item is

31:22

identical. That's why I'm underlining

31:24

and pointing out to the listeners

31:26

here, leather bootlaces by far the

31:29

best way to describe this

31:31

particular item. So if you look

31:34

up the, the technical definition of

31:36

thong, right? Like we're not talking

31:38

about Cisco's thong song from,

31:41

can you believe that song was like over

31:43

20 years old now that, that make you

31:45

feel old? It seems like it came out

31:47

yesterday. Yeah. He's not, we're not talking about

31:50

like a leather thong, like underwear type. And

31:52

then some people might even refer to sandals

31:54

or something of that nature as, as a

31:57

thought. We're not talking about anything like that. It, this.

32:00

This item, I've seen pictures of it. It's

32:03

36 inches in length and

32:05

it's made out of leather. I'm

32:08

calling it a boot lace. Technically,

32:10

I don't know that you

32:12

would see this for a boot lace.

32:15

The thing that I would think you would see this the

32:17

most of, like right when you go to festivals, concerts,

32:20

and what have you, you might see

32:22

this item being fashioned into some kind

32:24

of necklace where you would put

32:27

some piece of jewelry hanging on it and use

32:29

it as a necklace or use

32:31

it to fashion a leather

32:34

bracelet. Yeah, which was very common at the

32:36

time. I mean, this is the, you know,

32:39

peace, love, and flower power

32:41

movement. So you'd see these

32:44

kind of necklaces or wristbands

32:47

often made at festivals and sold so they

32:49

could make some money. I was really trying

32:51

to figure out, well, I mean, even, I

32:53

remember even in the nineties and two thousands,

32:56

people selling these things at festivals, you can

32:58

still see it today, but the thing I

33:00

was really trying to figure out here, captain,

33:02

with the description of this

33:04

murder weapon, mind you, it's

33:07

left on both women. So that means to

33:09

somebody, somebody either found these at the

33:11

scene and chose to use them or

33:16

brought them to the scene with them.

33:20

Now I've been struggling for a

33:22

couple of days to try to sort out my

33:24

head. Does that mean that they knew they were

33:26

going to kill two victims? I don't think that

33:28

that necessarily means that. It

33:30

could mean that they thought they were going, they

33:33

brought more than one for the

33:35

purpose of tying somebody up. And

33:38

for whatever reason, that didn't lay out at

33:40

the scene. Yeah. We

33:42

don't know because we're not, we

33:45

weren't there. So we don't know if the

33:47

killer or killers had a bunch

33:50

of these. Well, and

33:53

I'm pointing all this out to

33:55

just to state that our current

33:57

day understanding of the

33:59

women word garroted or

34:02

garrott just

34:04

simply does not apply here. Right. That,

34:06

so don't, don't have that image in your

34:09

head because I don't think it, it applies.

34:12

So the way that it's

34:14

described is as said 36 inches, both

34:17

of these items, and I'm

34:19

going to call them a boot lace going forward.

34:22

It says each lace, each

34:24

boot lace had been looped twice around

34:26

the neck than knotted in the back.

34:29

Both women were fully clothed and seemed

34:31

to have dropped almost immediately. Earl

34:34

friend, the investigator was struck by

34:36

the quote, lack of panic at

34:39

the crime scene. Robbery

34:41

was tentatively ruled out as the

34:43

antique store was not broken into.

34:46

There was a large amount of cash

34:48

and plain sight and Nancy Warren's trailer

34:50

that wasn't taken. And then

34:52

the, the, the

34:55

phrase that the investigator using

34:57

lack of panic, really

35:01

hit home with me because that made me think

35:03

that the women were taken by surprise.

35:08

Cause that that's not where my mind

35:10

goes. My mind goes, what

35:12

happened to them before this attack?

35:16

Well, was there drugs in their system?

35:18

Were they, were they drunk? Was

35:21

there a reason why they didn't put

35:23

up because to me panic almost equals struggle.

35:31

If you have a struggle, then the

35:33

person is panicking or you'd

35:35

see some kind of confusion or the crime

35:38

scene would be disheveled. Does

35:41

that make any sense? That's

35:44

what he's saying. There's no sign of that

35:46

at the scene. Yeah. So did they do

35:48

a toxicology report? That information

35:51

is not available. I don't even, I

35:53

mean, this is 68, right? So

35:55

is that, is that even something

35:58

that they were doing

36:02

obviously not at the level that they can are capable

36:04

of doing it now, but were

36:07

they doing that back then? I

36:09

can tell you this, the newspapers

36:11

and police back then were

36:14

quite, trying

36:17

to put this as politely as I can

36:19

on there. They're, they're rude, right?

36:21

Like it's 1968, right? Whether

36:26

or not she married Don Delaney, the

36:29

reason why that would be in such

36:31

dispute is because if they

36:33

were having a child together, whether they got

36:36

married or not, they may want to give

36:38

off the appearance of having been married and

36:41

her taking his last name, even

36:43

if there was no marriage license,

36:45

simply because of the shame that

36:47

would come from having a child

36:49

together at a wedlock today. That's,

36:53

that's every day, right? Back then

36:55

that was something that was really

36:58

incredibly frowned upon and even like

37:00

drinking and drugs

37:02

and anything of that nature was way more

37:04

frowned upon than it

37:06

is today. So had they found an

37:08

open bottle of liquor in the

37:11

living room with Nancy Warren, it would

37:13

have been all over the newspapers. They would have

37:15

said, Oh, there was a lack of panic because

37:17

she was, she was believed

37:19

to be intoxicated. They don't say

37:21

that. And so what I mean by lack of

37:23

panic here, you hit the nail on the head.

37:26

He's saying that not because there's

37:28

no that neither woman put

37:30

up a fight. He's saying that

37:33

because there's not, it didn't look like

37:35

the like a fight occurred that caused

37:37

a bunch of destruction

37:40

inside the trailer with Nancy Warren.

37:43

We know that she put up a fight because

37:46

we have unidentified suspect blood that

37:50

was found under her fingernails and

37:53

she was beaten severely. So

37:57

somebody attacked her. having

38:00

beat her and then strangled her. Klyda

38:02

was different. Even though we have the

38:04

little boy saying, I found my grandmother

38:06

the same as I had found my

38:08

mother. There's little

38:10

to no blood in Klyda's case.

38:13

She appears to have just been hit once

38:17

and we get no detail as far as

38:19

whether they believe this was with an item

38:21

or strictly just punched in the face. And

38:24

then she strangled. So

38:26

where they say lack of panic and

38:29

I say taken by surprise, I

38:32

don't think that Nancy Warren was expecting

38:34

that there was any kind of, that

38:36

there was going to be any kind

38:38

of problem with whoever was there. And

38:40

we probably don't know this, but do

38:42

we have defensive wounds on their neck

38:45

as you know, like what a lot

38:47

of people believe are moon shape marks

38:49

around John Benet's

38:51

neck? Do we have that

38:54

same situation here? Because if

38:56

somebody's being strangled to

38:58

death and they're, and they're fighting

39:00

off the attack, they

39:03

might not actually be fighting the attacker. They

39:05

might be fighting the object that's trying to

39:07

choke them. And so we would get

39:10

defensive wounds on their neck. I believe

39:12

they're kind of like half moon shapes or

39:15

a moon crest shape. I believe both of

39:17

these women, the way that it's been described

39:19

to me, I believe that

39:21

there's a good chance, especially with Klyda that

39:24

she was damn near knocked unconscious

39:26

with that one hit before she was strangled.

39:29

And I think very similar

39:31

could be the case with her

39:33

grandmother, Nancy. Here's what

39:36

we have here. The, the time of

39:38

death is difficult

39:40

here. And the papers really went after

39:42

the sheriff a bit here for not

39:44

being able to narrow down

39:48

the timeframe and when the two murders could have taken

39:50

place. They, they really

39:52

had a hard time with the sheriff on that. And

39:54

the sheriff was trying to explain to him. He's like,

39:56

look, it's not like it is on TV. We,

39:59

we can't. narrow it down very

40:01

well. Like, so the general time

40:03

of death for both was simply

40:05

listed as late Sunday, October 13th

40:07

or early Monday, October 14th. And

40:11

we know obviously in all

40:14

cases, very, very

40:16

important is the time of death, especially

40:18

in this case, because we have one

40:21

suspect, some might even call him the

40:23

prime suspect that could be completely eliminated

40:25

if the time of death were late

40:27

enough. It bothers

40:29

me, the weapon

40:32

of choice. Now, that's the

40:34

final weapon of death,

40:36

right? Is this boot

40:40

lace. One level, I

40:42

think having the same boot

40:45

lace around both victims next, you go,

40:48

well, that's one killer, right? But

40:50

then we don't know the motive. It's the same

40:52

type of boot lace, but it's not, I

40:55

mean, there were two of them. That is confusing

40:57

to me because we have basically

41:00

the same type of

41:03

boot lace around both victims next.

41:06

And so does it, does that point to

41:08

one killer or, or is

41:10

it, we don't understand the motive

41:13

so it's hard to understand the crime. So

41:16

maybe there was two, and then that would mean

41:18

that this was planned

41:20

out way more, but also we don't

41:22

have our

41:24

only eye witnesses or children. So

41:27

they can't tell us all by the way,

41:29

this, this boot lace came from my

41:31

mother. Yeah. That that's the part that

41:34

makes it very tough

41:37

on our end is

41:39

there. It doesn't sound to me like

41:42

the sheriff's office has a clue

41:44

whether these items were, I can't

41:47

talk to them, but just your gut feeling. What

41:49

do you think talk to him?

41:52

Why can't talk to

41:54

law enforcement? Um, because it's not

41:56

1968, but I'm just saying like

41:59

what my my gut

42:01

points to that this was thoroughly

42:04

planned out. I

42:07

guess I lean more towards that. This

42:09

is multiple, multiple killers. I

42:11

don't have a strong opinion on the number

42:14

of killers because I don't think that there's

42:16

enough information for me to arrive at any

42:18

type of conclusion here. I wouldn't rule out

42:20

the possibility that there were multiple killers because

42:22

of I just wanted to

42:25

know what, what, what you felt in your gut and what you

42:27

felt in your butt. Well, I don't

42:29

have a feeling is what I just said. No feeling in

42:31

the butt. I

42:33

just said there's not enough information to come

42:35

to a conclusion. If there was more than

42:37

one killer, what I was trying to say

42:39

is that what the reason why I wouldn't

42:42

rule that out is you have law enforcement

42:44

in this case that have said that there

42:46

is a possibility that this was

42:49

a two man job or, or

42:51

a two person job I

42:53

believe is the, their exact statement. And

42:56

the other thing that I think possibly

42:58

points to that and why

43:00

law enforcement is making that statement is

43:03

because the lack

43:05

of, I guess

43:08

for better word, destruction at the

43:11

crime scene, it

43:14

seems to be a more controlled situation.

43:16

And if you have one

43:18

killer on multiple victims, I

43:21

would think that you would see more

43:23

confusion at the

43:25

crime scene. True. But there's,

43:28

there's many scenarios where one could have

43:30

been killed and then the other is

43:32

killed later where you

43:35

don't have to control. You don't have to control

43:37

to, I mean, one's found inside a trailer once

43:39

found outside, right? I think

43:41

another thing that convolutes this whole case

43:43

is that when you start to look

43:45

at some of the suspects that they've

43:47

had in this case, a lot of

43:49

the suspects would point to regardless

43:52

if there's one or two killers, who's

43:54

the target here? If, if this was

43:56

not a robbery gone wrong, which

44:00

I don't know that I think that it was, but

44:03

who's the target here? Were both

44:05

women targeted or

44:08

was one the target and then the

44:10

other was collateral damage and

44:13

the suspects, when you review the suspect

44:15

list here, it, it's

44:17

suggestive that Klyda Jean,

44:21

the 24 year old, she was

44:23

the target because of the, the

44:25

close nature between her and some

44:27

of the suspects. However,

44:30

what the crime scene tells me, captain

44:33

is that I'm looking at a

44:36

scenario where I think somebody was in the

44:38

trailer with Nancy Warren kills her and the

44:40

commotion of that causes Klyda to come

44:44

walking over from her trailer to

44:46

see what's going on. And

44:49

she's intercepted by the killer or killers

44:51

or somebody on the lookout and

44:54

then killed between the two trailers.

44:57

If that's the scenario, then you

44:59

go, well, Nancy, right?

45:01

Whoever's taken out first is usually

45:03

the targeted victim. If you know

45:05

the victims,

45:08

you know how closely they're

45:10

connected. So in

45:12

order to kill one, you might have

45:14

decided that you have to kill two before

45:17

you even show up. Yeah. I mean,

45:20

they're practically, we, they're in

45:22

two trailers, but they're practically living

45:24

together. You don't get any more close than

45:26

that. And it could

45:28

be as simple of a situation as,

45:31

well, if you kill one, you have to

45:33

kill the other because the other will tell

45:35

everybody in their, in their cousin that I'm

45:37

the most likely killer, that

45:40

I'm the one that would be the

45:42

guy or the girl or somebody to look

45:44

at in this

45:46

case. The

45:48

thing that is so

45:51

problematic about this case is the description of

45:53

the crime scene and the description of the

45:55

evidence that's available to us all of these

45:58

years later. where

46:00

you have statements from the sheriff's office that

46:03

they say that these, that

46:05

they, there's no indication that

46:07

they think that the killer or killers

46:09

found these leather boot laces, for

46:12

lack of better term, at the crime

46:14

scene and then decided to use them,

46:16

right? We've covered many murder cases where

46:18

the, somebody takes a

46:20

kitchen knife from the victim's kitchen and

46:23

stabs them. And that

46:25

presents a whole different set

46:27

of possibilities where here there's

46:29

no, there's never any

46:32

mention that, that

46:34

these boot laces belong to

46:36

Nancy or to Clyde. So

46:38

based off of that, we

46:41

can go under the idea that they were

46:43

brought to the scene, but how much did

46:45

the sheriff's office know and how

46:48

much did investigators know about the, the

46:50

evidence that they're finding because they give

46:52

such strange statements, like one statement about

46:54

these, this leather cord that

46:57

that'd probably be a better description, these

46:59

leather cords, what they

47:01

say that they were new, these

47:04

were new leather cords, but we

47:06

don't believe that they were

47:09

purchased recently. Well,

47:11

how the hell would you know that? Like

47:13

they're new, right? Like,

47:15

like I get that maybe they're new, right?

47:17

You, you would see signs of, but we

47:20

know that they're new old stock.

47:22

You would see signs of wear and tear

47:24

on this particular item if they weren't new.

47:26

So I get how you arrive at that

47:29

conclusion, but then how did you get to

47:31

the statement of, well, we don't believe that

47:33

they were purchased recently. I

47:35

guess maybe it's leather, it dries out once

47:38

it's removed from the packaging, but

47:40

1968, I don't think

47:43

that you would even package these things,

47:45

right? Like you, that they would, they're

47:47

not showing up, you're not purchasing these

47:49

in, in plastic. They're

47:51

not sealed up in plastic before

47:54

you purchase them. So that statement

47:56

is very strange. I

47:58

hate to say it captain, but I think that. the, I

48:00

think that this crime,

48:02

and I will say this in

48:04

their defense, there appears

48:06

to be much confusion here

48:08

and that was working against

48:11

the investigation. Of course. But

48:13

it appears to me that this might

48:16

have been, these two

48:18

murders might have been out of

48:21

their league a little bit. They might

48:23

have been playing out of their league. So

48:36

much more to get to join us back here

48:38

in the garage for part two, same bat time,

48:40

same bat channel. And until then,

48:42

be good, be kind, and don't live. Time

48:53

for a quick break to

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talk about McDonald's. Time

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for a quick break to talk about

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