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1:18

this is Billie Jean King. This is

1:20

Marion Bartodi. This is Bianca Andreescu. I'm

1:22

Mats Villander. This is Mary Carrillo. This

1:24

is Pam Schreiber. This is Yannick Noah,

1:26

and you're listening to The Tennis Podcast.

1:30

Hello, and welcome to The Tennis

1:32

Podcast, our second daily tennis podcast from the

1:35

US Open 2024.

1:38

There are less than 48 hours

1:40

to go until the start of the final Grand Slam of

1:43

this tennis season. And you find us in the media garden

1:45

just outside the tennis court. And we're going to be talking

1:50

about the tennis world. And we're going to be

1:52

talking about the tennis world. And we're centre,

2:00

round by the practice courts, close

2:02

to where fans gather, awaiting

2:05

a glimpse of their favorite players. They

2:07

quite often stop and sign autographs there,

2:09

so if you hear some crowd

2:11

commotion it is absolutely not

2:14

for us. But it

2:16

is one of our favorite places

2:18

to record podcasts. We've

2:21

spent many a year here. My

2:23

mind always goes back to post-US

2:25

Open Final between Dan and Mevvedev

2:27

and Rafa on the dial here,

2:29

Catherine, which was was sort of

2:31

BM before Matt and

2:34

he was back home. I mean you

2:36

were alive! It

2:39

was it was BM T before

2:41

Matt traveling. Yes, that's what it

2:43

was. Catherine

2:45

and I did that podcast whilst drinking

2:47

several honey juices. It was rather

2:50

excellent. Yeah

2:52

I mean I wouldn't say no to a

2:54

honey juice right now. It hasn't been the

2:56

bombshell news day that we were perhaps

2:59

hoping for at the start of the

3:01

day has it Matt? No. Some

3:04

honey juices might help spice things up. And

3:06

it's funny that David references 2019 because

3:10

I always go back to 2019 and I believe Queens

3:13

of 2019 as

3:16

the bar for well we

3:18

can do a podcast whenever because I believe

3:20

we did a podcast that that Queens where

3:22

there was no play at all like the

3:24

whole day was canceled because of rain and

3:27

yet we still did a pod and I'm

3:29

always like well we got through that so

3:31

we can pretty much get through anything. That

3:34

theory is being tested today because let me tell

3:36

you not much has happened at

3:38

the US Open today. No

3:41

I mean that is I mean look big

3:43

names have come through the

3:45

media room haven't they? We've had

3:47

Carlos Alcras, we've had Novak Djokovic,

3:50

we've had reigning Wimbledon champion Barbara

3:52

Kroczikowi, two-time former champion Naomi

3:54

Osaka, we've had Jack Draper and actually

3:56

Jack Draper might have ended up giving

3:58

us one of the biggest stories of

4:00

the day but everybody's

4:03

just sort of feeling quite good

4:05

and quite happy and they once

4:07

got any big revelations nobody's you

4:10

know been living under

4:12

the threat of a doping ban for the

4:14

last four months everything's just quite

4:17

harmonious. And I think that

4:20

was newsworthy because there was a brief

4:23

scare around midday when

4:26

Carlos Alcaraz rolled

4:28

his ankle I don't even know

4:30

if that's quite fair

4:33

as a description did something

4:35

to his ankle tweaked yes

4:37

while practicing and didn't

4:40

actually continue with his practice spoke

4:42

to one Carlos Ferrero who

4:45

David had seen before we were even

4:47

out of bed this morning that's less

4:49

weird than I've made it sound yes

4:53

I was I was in the local

4:55

there little supermarket stroke pharmacy and I

4:57

stood there and I have to say

4:59

I hadn't had a shower by this

5:01

point so I must have looked a

5:03

right state but I desperately needed some

5:05

bin bags because that because

5:08

our bin was overflowing. It disheveled David

5:10

Lawton's shop for bin bags. I

5:13

bet when Carlos Ferrero looked pristine. He did

5:16

and he was he was it was only

5:18

about 8 30 in the morning he walks

5:20

past with his with his wife and his two very

5:22

young kids and I mean he

5:25

just sort of looked through the window and saw

5:27

me and he was oh he waved and

5:29

I oh no right quickly

5:31

get behind the counter so nobody else

5:34

could see me. So

5:37

well he obviously got himself over

5:39

to Flushy Meadows then for practice with Carlos

5:41

Alcaraz and I must admit when

5:43

when the initial tweet came through and

5:46

said oh no Carlos Alcaraz has rolled

5:48

his ankle I did

5:50

think oh crikey that's all we'd blummin

5:52

need I mean the men's drawers barren

5:54

enough as it is and I don't

5:56

need him being dumped out before the

5:58

things even started. But anyway,

6:01

as a sort of cooler

6:03

head started to take over an actual

6:05

video evidence surface, you

6:07

looked at it and it really was just a

6:10

little jarring of it. And he could not

6:12

have been more reassuring about it in press,

6:15

could he? He said he stopped

6:18

out of a sense of precaution.

6:20

He said, I think it's okay. Wasn't

6:23

worried at all for my US

6:25

Open participation, he said. He

6:29

was also totally reassuring in

6:32

a very Roger Federer-esque way

6:35

about his lack of hardcore

6:37

matches coming in. He said, it

6:39

doesn't matter for me. He

6:42

said, I'd like more matches, but

6:44

it doesn't affect me at all. It was

6:46

very kind of, you

6:48

can get away with that because you're Carlos

6:50

Alcaraz, but someone else saying that, it sounds

6:53

quite arrogant, but it's fine because

6:55

it's you. And he also backed

6:58

it up with evidence from the summer, okay,

7:00

not hardcore, but he pointed out that he

7:03

hadn't had that many matches on the clay

7:05

and his preparation for Roland Garros hadn't been

7:07

ideal. And then he said, that

7:09

worked out okay. And then the

7:11

same at Wimbledon, when he obviously had only

7:14

played probably a couple of matches on the

7:16

grass prior to Wimbledon, and then that

7:18

worked out okay as well. So in

7:21

his own way, he has actually

7:23

sort of been a slam

7:26

specialist this year, like outside

7:28

of the summer, his

7:31

results haven't been all that consistent or

7:33

impressive on the rest of the tour.

7:36

You know, and obviously, Indian Wells was great, but you

7:38

know, he's had a lot of setbacks,

7:40

but at the slams, at the biggest

7:42

events, he's

7:44

been excellent, obviously, in

7:47

the last couple of months. And I think

7:49

that has built up his confidence that means

7:51

that he can come in here and put

7:53

Cincinnati down to an extreme, you

7:56

know, it was coming off the back of the

7:58

Olympics, the conditions were crazy. it wasn't

8:00

like tennis, I think he can write

8:02

that off and come in here feeling

8:05

pretty confident. And I felt

8:07

a little bit bad about the question

8:09

that I put to Carlos Alcaraz because

8:11

a large reason he'd go to an

8:13

Alcaraz press conference is just for the

8:15

vibes. Like he's not a quote machine,

8:17

is he, generally speaking, but it's

8:19

always worth lapping up some

8:21

Alcaraz vibes. But I did

8:24

actually kind of ask him about bad vibes.

8:26

I of course asked him about the Olympics. But

8:31

I wanted to get out of him sort

8:34

of how new that disappointment

8:36

and low felt for

8:39

him. He's never lost to Grand Samphain,

8:41

he's only lost one five-set

8:43

match in his life and you

8:45

know those tend to be the

8:47

most heartbreaking losses, don't they? And

8:50

we all saw and we described

8:53

and analysed how heartbroken

8:55

and shocked and

8:58

gutted he was to lose that gold

9:01

medal match to Novac Djokovic. And

9:04

yes, I think it was a new experience

9:06

for him feeling that bad

9:09

after a loss. But I also

9:11

think it's going to end up

9:13

being a positive for him because

9:15

he's kind of got that experience

9:17

out of the way in

9:19

a match where he still came away with something. He

9:22

still came away with the silver medal

9:24

and an achievement in itself, which yes,

9:26

having Grand Slam final on your CV

9:28

is an achievement. But when you've already

9:30

won Grand Slams, reaching a

9:33

final doesn't, you know, it's like

9:35

your GCSE results, it drops off the

9:37

CV, doesn't it? As soon as you get your

9:39

first job or your second job maybe. And I,

9:42

you know, he's, I'm

9:44

not saying he's never going to lose a Grand Slam final,

9:46

but I, he's just a

9:48

sponge, isn't he? He's learning from everything. So

9:50

I think he will look back on the

9:52

Olympics still as a positive experience because he

9:54

came away with a silver medal. But

9:58

he's also getting the positives negative

10:00

experience if you like and the

10:03

learnings from that. You know

10:05

I don't think he was pleased

10:07

with how he handled what

10:10

was coming at him from Novak Djokovic in that

10:12

final. It might be that there was no handling

10:14

it because Djokovic was so good

10:17

that day but I still

10:19

think he feels he could have handled that a lot

10:21

better. He was he was shocked and

10:23

rocked on his heels that day and I also

10:25

love that he said I

10:27

don't know if I'm gonna get another chance to

10:30

fight for a gold medal. He said I

10:32

hope so and I'll fight for that

10:35

but I'm taking nothing for granted and I

10:38

really liked hearing that from somebody

10:40

that has suffered relatively so

10:42

few setbacks and such little

10:44

strife in his career. I

10:46

think it'd be easy for him to think oh

10:49

well everything's just gonna always go my way

10:51

because I'm Carlos Alcaraz and

10:53

I'm that good. Yeah and there's

10:55

no telling physically what

10:57

state he'll be in in three or

11:00

four years time so

11:03

and it's good that he's realistic about that yeah it

11:05

is but it strikes

11:09

me that I've often thought of

11:11

him as a rookie really somebody

11:13

who's still so new on the scene

11:15

but actually what are we into now

11:17

is this is fourth US Open if

11:19

you think back to the 2021 edition

11:21

where he had that incredible win over

11:24

Sitza Pass and in

11:26

the Radocana year and and

11:29

then eventually won the title

11:31

the following year. It's still only

11:34

three editions of this tournament but he

11:36

is accumulating experience now and

11:38

it just it feels like

11:40

it's that is a big addition

11:43

to his armory almost it's

11:45

not just a

11:47

question of going through the motions he is soaking

11:49

it up. And just a final

11:51

point on Alcaraz well we're talking about him

11:53

actually goes back to something we

11:56

were talking about yesterday and something that came

11:58

up after we finished recording. the podcast yesterday

12:00

David and it was in relation to Peter

12:03

Lundgren who you paid beautiful

12:06

tribute to yesterday. We found

12:09

out that he passed away yesterday morning. It

12:11

was really sad news for the tennis world

12:13

and he told a story about something Peter

12:15

Lundgren has said about Federer's

12:19

learning process, his

12:22

trajectory in terms of learning to volley. Yeah,

12:25

yeah, he said at the time

12:27

because this was very,

12:29

this was similarly early in Roger Federer's

12:31

career, even earlier, but he'd been around

12:33

for a couple of years, maybe two

12:35

and a half years, but he hadn't

12:38

won anything. I mean, this was pre-beating

12:40

Pete Sampras in Wimbledon. So, you know,

12:42

Carlos Alcrash, you're looking at with four

12:44

Grand Slam titles, they were poles

12:46

apart in terms of experience, but it

12:48

was already very clear with Federer that he

12:51

had the raw material to be anything

12:55

he wanted to be. That's how it

12:57

came across. But when I spoke to

13:00

Peter Lundgren about his volleying, he said,

13:02

you know, at the start, the truth

13:04

is he absolutely hated to volley. He

13:07

said it was like there were sharks inside

13:09

the service box. Incredible line. He just didn't

13:12

want to be in the forecourt and he

13:14

said, so we really worked at it and

13:16

worked at it and worked at it and

13:18

now the sharks have gone. And I remember

13:20

thinking, because, you know, you see him in

13:22

such a pristine volley in the

13:24

latter stages and how he, that was the

13:26

lion's share of his attack, wasn't it? It was all

13:28

about getting forward. And it seemed so natural

13:30

to him. Yeah. So to hear about how

13:33

unnatural it felt to him at the start

13:35

is fascinating. It definitely feels

13:37

like of all those players, Al

13:40

Krasz feels like he's the one who's come out

13:44

ready to go, you know, sort of

13:46

showroom ready, if you like, for the

13:48

tennis tour. Think of how Nadal added

13:50

to his game over the years. Djokovic

13:53

has just added on every level,

13:56

the serve, the movement, the approach,

13:58

the tactics, the touch. I'm

14:01

not necessarily expecting that from Al

14:03

Khraz. I think it's more going

14:05

to be how do you handle

14:08

situations, moments, experiences, the

14:10

game itself, it

14:12

feels ready already. Yeah, and it

14:14

just made me think about, you know, I know

14:16

we always talk about what a natural Al Khraz

14:18

is at everything and how

14:21

complete his game is and how exciting

14:23

he is, but I just,

14:26

I don't think, I can think

14:28

of a place on the tennis court or

14:30

a situation on the tennis court where he

14:32

would ever feel like there are

14:34

sharks circling. Like it

14:37

all comes so naturally to

14:39

him, as you say, they're still

14:41

learning to do in terms of

14:43

experiences, but in terms of the

14:45

game, like it's

14:48

a different kettle of fish even to Federer.

14:51

Yeah, it's always been

14:54

the thing that Pundit,

14:56

who've seen way

14:58

more generations of the sport than I have,

15:00

have always said that he seemed like the

15:03

most complete young player

15:05

that they'd ever seen and naturally

15:08

gifted in all the different areas.

15:12

Yeah, like it's really hard to argue

15:14

with that and he

15:16

was asked today in his press conference at Al Khraz about

15:19

sort of what it is about his game that

15:21

he thinks is the

15:24

hardest for the opponents and

15:27

he didn't say it in those exact terms, but

15:29

he did kind of say that element that they

15:32

don't know what's coming next. He's

15:34

got so many options and because

15:37

they don't know what's coming next, he said something

15:39

like they have to constantly fight

15:41

to keep alive, which

15:44

again, the way

15:47

he said it, it didn't sound quite so sort

15:49

of menacing. He said I

15:52

push my opponents to the absolute

15:54

limit, which again, quite threatening. And then

15:56

in a nice grin after he said it, it was

15:58

all kind of a thing. classic Al

16:00

Khraiz, but it's true. His

16:03

ability to not only have all

16:05

the shots, but deploy

16:07

them intelligently

16:10

is extraordinary. I

16:12

think we've seen when

16:15

he's stressed maybe,

16:17

he doesn't always do that. That is

16:19

a development that he can make. I

16:21

think sometimes his game can look a

16:23

bit ragged and he can just go for

16:25

too much and it can all get a little bit

16:27

out of control and

16:30

I'm thinking mostly

16:32

about the two Grand Sam

16:34

losses he's had against Alexander Zverev, to be honest.

16:36

Those are the ones where that's been most prominent,

16:39

I would say, but he's getting better at

16:42

that all the time. And yeah, that's

16:45

such an amazing quote from Peter

16:47

Lundgren and it

16:50

did make me think of Al Khraiz as

16:53

kind of the one who hasn't really

16:55

had those shocks. So

16:57

the other player, and in fact, they came

16:59

in back to back into the main press conference room. The other

17:02

player that we were sort of

17:05

edgily waiting for injury updates from

17:07

was Novak Djokovic, because of

17:09

course, there were these reports,

17:11

confirmed reports, I think, that he bailed

17:14

on a practice with Holger Roona yesterday. There

17:16

were some reports that he had bailed on

17:18

a practice today, but I think those were

17:21

rode back on. But certainly yesterday, Djokovic

17:23

had confirmed that he did bail on

17:25

a practice with some soreness. Well,

17:28

he put that all to bed, I think,

17:32

today. Matt, is that how you felt being in

17:34

that press conference? I felt like, okay,

17:36

injury's not a thing here really

17:39

with Novak Djokovic. And he

17:41

does tell us when it is, doesn't he? He really,

17:43

he lets us know. Exactly.

17:46

I think there may

17:48

well be a little bit of soreness.

17:51

You know, he hasn't

17:54

played all that much on hard courts this

17:58

year, really, has he? if

18:00

you think about it and all the

18:02

different surface changes from clay

18:04

to grass, back to clay, while also

18:07

managing an injury. I could imagine that

18:09

maybe his body

18:11

isn't in absolute peak

18:13

physical condition right now and

18:15

given his age as well,

18:18

I think you do start feeling things a little bit more

18:20

but I don't think it's a

18:22

worry for his tournament. I think maybe it

18:24

was just something that he's going to

18:26

be managing through this tournament

18:28

and he's so good at

18:32

that. Generally

18:34

I thought I was

18:36

kind of expecting him to be a bit buzzier

18:39

given that he's just won the Olympics

18:42

which is, and he

18:44

said today, again, the greatest

18:47

accomplishment in his career. He's so proud of

18:49

that and he actually walked out on the

18:51

Arthur Ashe Stadium for Kids Day wearing his

18:54

gold medal. He's brought it

18:56

with him. I'm here for that.

18:58

Oh, I'd wear it every

19:00

day. Kevin would

19:02

wear it to bed. Got a

19:04

new necklace, guys. But actually

19:06

his press

19:09

conference was very much business,

19:13

face-on, game mode on. There

19:16

was one sort of jokey moment

19:18

where it was pointed out to him and

19:20

it's something I've forgotten but it is quite

19:22

interesting that no man has defended this title

19:25

since Federer in 2008. It's been a very long time and

19:27

he's obviously looking to

19:29

do that. He was asked, what

19:32

do you need to do to change

19:34

that? He jokingly just said, defend the

19:36

title. But other

19:38

than that, there was

19:41

no breaking the quite steely face

19:43

that he had on. I guess

19:45

I was just maybe

19:49

expecting him to be a little

19:52

bit more jovial post-Olympics but perhaps

19:55

that's a good sign in terms of

19:57

motivation. He's straight back on to the next

19:59

thing. I think he was kind of

20:01

his own version of Buzzy, wasn't he? Like

20:03

he talked a lot

20:05

about that gold medal and

20:08

was prepared to put things in pretty

20:10

definitive terms. He said it was the

20:12

greatest moment and achievement of my whole

20:14

career. He

20:16

said it's the most intense emotions he's ever had

20:18

on a tennis court. He said prior to that,

20:22

kind of the proudest moment of his career was carrying

20:25

the flag at the 2021 Tokyo Olympics and

20:29

only winning gold has superseded

20:32

that. But he's

20:35

very sincere and earnest about it.

20:37

It's something about representing his country.

20:41

It almost comes with a heaviness, I think, as

20:44

well as pride and happiness

20:46

and all the rest of it. But

20:48

yeah, he was happy to talk about

20:50

the Olympics and that gold medal at

20:53

great length. He was also perfectly

20:55

happy to be asked about the

20:57

Anaxina situation. He was very much being

21:00

asked as a talisman

21:02

of the PTPA. And

21:07

he said, cases

21:09

like this are the reason we

21:11

founded the PTPA. And

21:13

he definitely used it as a sort of promo

21:17

opportunity, really, for the

21:20

PTPA and what they're

21:22

about and why they exist.

21:25

Now, I don't know if the

21:27

PTPA is necessarily the answer to this

21:30

question. I don't

21:32

think they've always been brilliant, certainly

21:35

in terms of communication and

21:37

the front end of things, but

21:40

I certainly think there's an opportunity for

21:42

them here to make

21:44

the case for a player's union and

21:47

why it's important and valuable

21:50

and necessary. And he

21:52

sounded quite frustrated by

21:54

the fact that the PTPA doesn't

21:56

have yet the

21:58

influence thinks it could

22:01

and probably should have. He

22:03

said he wasn't going to go into that in that

22:05

press conference, but I

22:07

think his hopes for the

22:10

PTPA when they formed those few

22:12

years ago were far

22:15

grander than what they've actually been able to

22:18

achieve so far. But

22:20

he did, well, he was

22:22

pretty clear that

22:25

he thinks that not

22:28

all doping

22:30

cases are necessarily treated the same and there

22:33

was some sort of procedural

22:37

element that needs to improve with these

22:40

doping cases and he

22:42

was extending his sympathy to players

22:44

who've been in similar situations and had

22:46

to wait a long time for

22:49

their cases to be resolved. He didn't name

22:51

check anyone specifically but that's who he was

22:53

kind of talking about and he

22:55

clearly thinks that the system

22:57

can be improved. He talked

23:00

about lawyers and the financial element

23:03

of it. He essentially

23:05

said the ability to defend yourself in

23:08

these cases shouldn't depend on your

23:10

wealth and the funds that you have available to you,

23:12

which is a very

23:14

interesting philosophical point because

23:17

in legal cases

23:19

in life it does.

23:21

It shouldn't, I don't think. Don't

23:26

get me started on legal aid cuts. I mean

23:28

legal aid is a thing. You're not left defenceless

23:31

and unable to defend yourself at all,

23:33

but in terms of the quality of

23:35

legal support that you'd have available to

23:37

you, there are haves and have nots

23:39

and it absolutely affects outcomes.

23:42

So it's a very interesting

23:46

philosophical question but

23:49

this does feel like a moment of

23:51

opportunity for the PTPA if they have

23:54

their act together enough

23:56

to capitalise on it and I

23:58

honestly don't know. if they

24:00

do, but maybe we'll find out. Yeah,

24:04

maybe this is what they've been waiting

24:07

for to some degree and perhaps

24:09

a player like Sinner is going

24:11

to turn around and

24:16

look at a union

24:18

like that and see its value a

24:20

little bit more. I mean

24:22

obviously, as you say, he was independently financially

24:24

wealthy enough to be able to sort things

24:26

out himself, get the best lawyers on the

24:28

case immediately. But he

24:32

obviously felt a little uncomfortable

24:34

that he knows that's not

24:36

how it is for everybody. I

24:39

mean it does feel like

24:41

that is something that should happen

24:43

one day, that there should be

24:45

a proper players' representative union. And

24:48

whilst I think there are virtues to

24:50

the ACP tour and the WTA tour,

24:54

it's never going to be

24:56

completely satisfactory, is it? Yeah,

25:00

I mean... Because of the conflict between

25:02

tours and tournaments? Organizations without conflicts

25:04

of interest is for

25:07

the betterment of the sport. Conflicts

25:10

of interest are the issues here, is

25:13

what's at issue here I think. Competing

25:15

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to 40%. in

34:00

the day who I really enjoyed

34:02

that creativity for press conference. Me

34:06

too, me too. Yeah she's

34:08

really cool I think. Yeah

34:10

and she's she

34:13

is cool but I feel like she's

34:15

been rocked over the last couple of

34:17

years by I guess

34:20

she didn't know about this this

34:22

world of being a big single star she

34:24

was a big double star she won a

34:26

lot but not many people took much notice

34:28

of what she said or did really then

34:31

she wins the French Open and

34:33

I mean as she was she was explaining there's

34:36

been a lot more on her plate since winning Wimbledon

34:38

than there was after winning the French Open it

34:41

was quite an order of magnitude of interest

34:43

difference but but she

34:45

had the experience to bubble a critique

34:47

of a year or

34:50

so ago of just kind

34:52

of throwing out there that she wanted to be part

34:54

of the conversation at the very top of the game

34:56

you know and kind of sort of used

35:00

the expression I'd love to be part of a big

35:02

four rather than it just being a big three with

35:04

Sabalenko and Rebecca and Eegis Fiontek

35:06

and because she then went on a

35:08

really bad run that she

35:11

kind of became a bit of a

35:13

laughing stalker on social media and and

35:15

in it was often brought up

35:18

and and I I think that that that

35:21

hurt her. Yeah I

35:23

think so too. It's funny isn't it

35:25

because there are some characters that

35:29

now having been through that would be

35:31

like see I told you yeah I've

35:34

got twice as many slams as Rebecca now you laughed

35:36

at me when I said it should be a big

35:39

four but who's laughing now but she's she's

35:41

not that character no no and and

35:43

I mean my question to her was do

35:45

you feel more relaxed coming

35:48

into this tournament I know

35:50

it's a big deal but you've already won Wimbledon

35:53

so it's it's fine you know you can

35:55

you can you can freewheel it

35:57

and enjoy this and maybe and get and not

35:59

and she's but

38:00

equally it does feel like a really free

38:02

hit for her here. There can be no

38:04

more questions about Bob Ora,

38:06

Craig Chikover, she just won funny little line

38:08

from her. She was asked what the most

38:10

fun thing about being a

38:13

Wimbledon champion was. David,

38:16

were you expecting her to say dancing with

38:18

Carlos Alcaraz at the ball? I wasn't. That

38:22

what she said. Yup, and then.

38:25

She sort of, I mean, it was one of those, sometimes

38:28

when we get asked, who's the

38:30

best player to watch up close, like at the live

38:33

show the other day, you're suddenly scrambling around for something

38:35

because it can't think of anything. The name

38:37

tennis player problem. Yeah, and I got the sense that

38:39

she was sort of thinking, oh, I haven't

38:41

really got an answer here. But it

38:43

turns out, David, she really did have an answer. It

38:48

was Willie Weinbaum from ESPN that asked the question,

38:50

wasn't it? And it was a great question and

38:53

she's responded to it really well, but then after

38:56

describing the joy of

38:58

dancing with Carlos Alcaraz at the ball, she

39:00

said, of course, you know,

39:02

you've seen the video. And he said, what

39:05

video? And she said, it's all

39:07

over Twitter. How can you not have seen the

39:09

video? Poor Willie was like, oh, I'll go and

39:11

find it and watch it. Sounds

39:13

like Willie has set some excellent boundaries for

39:16

himself and isn't spending all of his life

39:18

on Twitter. We could all learn from that.

39:20

Not chronically online with Weinbaum.

39:24

Yeah, I really wanted to waste

39:26

my question to Carlos Alcaraz asking

39:28

how he felt about the dance.

39:31

But I asked a sensible question instead.

39:35

But maybe I'll ask at some point throughout

39:37

the fortnight, watch this space, folks. No

39:41

Mirosaka came through press this morning.

39:44

Nothing hugely of note, really?

39:48

No, not really. There

39:51

was, I think,

39:53

a line that's probably important that

39:56

kind of we keep the perspective with Osaka. You know,

39:58

we spent a great. kind of deal

40:01

of our live show actually talking about

40:03

Nomi Asaka and you

40:06

know the fact that the results

40:08

haven't really been resulting as as

40:11

she would say recently but

40:13

she said that you know last

40:15

year she was in the press conference

40:17

room but not because she was playing

40:20

you know she was hoping to come back absolutely

40:22

she was planning to come back but you know

40:25

that is only a year ago and and

40:27

I think I remember something that she said

40:30

at the time when she did come back was like

40:32

I've fast-tracked this

40:34

really like it's you

40:37

know people often very much talk about

40:40

you know sort of mothers

40:42

coming back as being an inspiration and

40:45

Asaka was was kind of like I

40:48

don't you shouldn't

40:50

be holding everyone to this standard you know

40:52

I've been having extreme

40:55

professionals around me who've allowed me to

40:57

get back so quickly but it is

41:00

still a very short space of time was only

41:02

a year ago that she wasn't playing and I

41:04

suppose I think she's got that perspective on

41:06

her career right now like yes she's she's

41:09

desperate for a result and she said this place

41:11

of all is the one where I think

41:13

she maybe expects the most of herself

41:16

and would most like to play well

41:18

here but you know I

41:20

think she also knows that she is she's

41:23

in the middle of a process right now

41:25

and that's important

41:30

to remember when maybe she hasn't quite

41:32

been having the results that that we

41:34

think she's capable of that she thinks

41:36

she's capable of like it can still

41:38

come if if this is

41:40

going to be a long-term comeback she's still

41:43

very early in this and

41:45

I think I think that was kind of an

41:47

important reminder from her important

41:50

to remember when I'm cursing how

41:52

crap Asaka Ostapenko turns out to

41:54

be a couple

41:56

of results in from events

41:58

this week we still have a the final

42:00

in Monterey to come later

42:03

on today. That final

42:05

between Lulu Sun and and

42:08

Linda Noskova. Really cool to see Lulu Sun backing

42:10

up what she did at Wimbledon. But

42:12

we have had the final in

42:14

the land. There's

42:17

only one land guys, it is Cleveland.

42:20

And the champion there is the American

42:22

wildcard McCartney Kessler. She beat

42:24

the top-seared Beatrice Adajmaiah in the final, 7-5

42:26

in the third. Now

42:29

then, full disclosure, we

42:31

didn't know who McCartney Kessler was before yesterday.

42:35

She's 25 years old, the

42:38

WTA website doesn't know much about her either, but she

42:40

is ranked inside the world's top 100. She's 98 in

42:42

the world and she's just won

42:47

her first title, which is

42:49

amazing. And I always

42:51

find it quite interesting then to follow how they

42:53

get on when they come here. Which

42:56

court they're going to go on, what's the reaction

42:58

going to be, can they bring it

43:00

in. I mean it's tough physically isn't it? And

43:02

sometimes emotionally when you've had a big moment like

43:04

that. But yeah, now's the time to get to

43:07

know her. Absolutely. And

43:09

we've also had the

43:11

final in Winston-Salem, the

43:13

ATP 250 there. Title

43:15

one by Lorenzo Sonago, 6-love-6-3 over

43:20

Alex Mickelson in

43:22

the final. Great result

43:24

for Sonago, I think he's now won titles

43:27

on all surfaces, which

43:29

is no mean feat at all. But it

43:32

will be Alex Mickelson that steals the

43:34

headlines for this because, well

43:36

quite frankly, he should have been defaulted in

43:39

the early stages of this final. By the way, the rules

43:41

are written, as things stand, I mean he smashed

43:43

a ball in frustration when he went love four

43:46

down, down the other end of the court and

43:48

he hit it sort of slightly with a bit

43:50

of underspin and so you imagine it would sort

43:53

of veer upwards and it went

43:55

straight into the front row of the spectators

43:57

at the far end. a

44:00

split second you watch him hit the ball

44:02

and then suddenly cover his head in an

44:05

oh no what have I done kind

44:07

of way because he hit that ball pretty

44:09

hard and the umpire came down

44:12

we didn't see a proper replay of where

44:14

the ball went we saw the

44:16

umpire come down and go and speak to and

44:19

check on whoever had been hit by

44:21

the ball and and really or that

44:25

that is a it

44:27

feels like an automatic default as the rules are

44:29

written you think of what Novak Djokovic

44:31

did here four

44:33

years ago we've seen other cases like it

44:36

I mean the

44:38

fact that it is a final and

44:41

you've got a lot of people there here to

44:43

see a final and at four love you're saying

44:46

end the match makes

44:49

you wonder whether you need a different rule

44:52

of some kind in order to punish the player

44:54

this is what I was wondering having been involved

44:56

in the David now banding disqualification in the

44:59

final at Queens in 2012 is maybe

45:02

the way around it is to to

45:04

punish retrospectively so that people get a

45:06

match but then the player absolutely

45:08

gets hammered and maybe

45:10

loses a tournament or a load of

45:13

prize money or something like that subsequently

45:17

I think I'd sign for that I

45:20

mean once again it's consistency

45:23

is the issue here and you need to

45:25

let us know what the rule is and

45:28

then keep to it I I thought

45:30

it was pretty binary the

45:32

rule about smashing balls into

45:34

crowds but apparently

45:36

on the bait I mean this seems like one

45:38

of the worst ones

45:42

of this type that we've seen it does feel

45:44

like there has been an uptick in

45:47

incidences of this type

45:49

this seems a pretty bad one

45:51

and he's got a warning

45:53

and carried on like what are we

45:55

doing here right I this

45:57

throws everything up into the air I don't I

46:00

don't understand the rules now. No,

46:04

same. I've seen just a

46:06

little clip of the incident. I haven't seen

46:08

it all that closely, but

46:14

players cannot be hitting the ball

46:16

aggressively into the crowd. That

46:18

simply cannot be allowed to happen. And

46:23

I really think he should have been defaulted.

46:27

I agree. Like, it

46:31

would absolutely suck for the

46:33

people there in the crowd if

46:37

they didn't get a final because of something like

46:39

that. But

46:42

I kind of still think that just

46:45

because it's a final doesn't necessarily

46:47

mean that you should have a different rule. I

46:51

wonder whether you think that that should be the rule

46:53

generally. I think if it was the first round and

46:55

there was a match to follow, are

46:57

you still saying that you should continue

46:59

the match and that the punishment should

47:02

come retrospectively? Or is it just the

47:04

fact that it's a final? I mean,

47:06

look, I suppose because it is a

47:08

final and a showpiece occasion, and

47:11

they haven't got anything else, so, OK, maybe there's a

47:13

doubles final, but they haven't got lots of other

47:15

things they could go to instead. But

47:18

you're right. I mean, is that fair? Is

47:20

that right to do it like that? And

47:22

I also... And what happens,

47:24

Catherine, if you actually really injure

47:26

somebody? You know... You've

47:30

got to... You shouldn't be allowed

47:32

to continue, I don't think, if you've actually,

47:34

you know, done damage

47:37

to someone like that. But I also

47:39

think if you make it a straight

47:41

default, if you do anything even like

47:43

that, it just would stop happening. Yeah,

47:46

that's a fair point. Well, exactly. And I

47:48

think it's the ultimate punishment

47:50

is to be defaulted on the

47:53

spot. And it's

47:55

kind of embarrassing to

47:57

be defaulted from a final. Like, you're not going to

47:59

be... Again the all the fans

48:01

that have bought those tickets not

48:04

getting the final that's on you. Yeah,

48:06

you carry that Just

48:09

imagine that but there are implications, you know,

48:11

a lot of tickets will

48:13

have a It's

48:16

a weather clause about you know, if you don't get a

48:18

certain amount of play you get a refund I

48:22

mean, I don't know what you do all of that I

48:24

mean I I have been on a tennis

48:26

court with a full house of

48:29

people booing Me

48:31

and the tournament director and not even David

48:33

now Banyan because they didn't know they didn't

48:36

get a replay and really get to see

48:38

what he'd done So they're

48:40

just wondering why that why we've walked out

48:42

and stopped the match and

48:44

so we're literally getting booed Happy

48:50

days Happy

48:53

memories Yeah,

48:56

I did How

48:58

many how many times this have to happen? It

49:00

feels like someone's gonna have to be

49:03

really badly injured other than Arno gabass

49:06

for for something

49:09

Significant to be done about this.

49:11

I know gabass was the the umpire. They got

49:13

hit by a Very young

49:15

Dennis Chappell of it the Davis Cup

49:17

back in back in the day Sorry,

49:21

sorry Dennis to bring that up. Sorry Chappell

49:25

Chappell we got exposed to some UTS

49:27

last night Got anything

49:29

say about that man? In

49:31

fact, Dave you got exposed to UTS and

49:34

pickleball on the telly last night. Yeah

49:36

back to back. That was a That

49:39

was a rough hour It's

49:41

got its own channel here Pickleball

49:44

forest Hills the youth.

49:46

Yeah, it is ultimate that ultimate

49:51

Not what my eyes were watching One

49:54

sir, I didn't know that you get one Faulting

49:57

so much so many faults

50:00

It's just service error after

50:03

service error. I do love that

50:05

the umpire has to call out

50:07

the nicknames though. Game

50:10

El Greco. No they don't do games

50:12

do they? 9-8 El Greco. Who

50:16

is that? All with a

50:18

straight face. That is Sitsipas. Okay.

50:21

And my

50:24

favourite was Caspar Roode who

50:26

is the Ice Man. But

50:30

his name was being called the Ice Man

50:33

like it was a surname. Which

50:36

made me think of the Chandler bit in Friends.

50:38

It's not Spiderman. It's not. So

50:43

actually maybe I did have quite a lot of

50:45

fun watching UTS last night. But

50:47

it is not ultimate. And

50:51

didn't Monfiez win? La Monf, Matt. Who

50:55

got disqualified from one in the past

50:57

and said it was a joke

51:00

or something. Maybe the tour

51:02

needs to have a look at UTS because they

51:04

don't mind disqualifying people. Even though

51:07

they say they don't have a code

51:09

of conduct. There's only one joke here.

51:11

Ohh tennis. The pickleball. I

51:15

mean I actually decided

51:17

to watch a few points to sort of see

51:20

if there was anything to it. There

51:24

isn't. There certainly isn't as a

51:26

spectator sport is there? Come on.

51:28

I don't want to disparage people that play pickleball and

51:31

really enjoy it. Like that's fine. Don't

51:35

try and force it on us

51:37

as a spectator sport. It's not all sports are spectator

51:40

sports and that's fine. Pickleball is

51:42

a crap spectacle. There were quite

51:44

a lot of spectators in the arena and

51:46

none of them were even applauding. Like when points

51:49

were finished. I didn't understand why.

51:52

It was quite hard to tell when a point was finished

51:54

I found. It was just sort

51:56

of a continuous, just like a

51:58

training drill. we

52:00

had a very strange camera angle that can't

52:02

normally be the pickleball camera angle well it

52:05

was the side on I

52:11

don't think that the pickleball channel we're not gonna

52:13

get into it are we well I think we already

52:15

have anyway

52:19

shall I tell our lovely listeners

52:21

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checkout hello

53:48

to Bruno our US Open

53:50

mascots Bruno apparently

53:53

is very anxious very

53:56

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53:58

we can see you you Bruno.

54:00

It's gonna be alright Bruno. It's gonna be

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alright Bruno. Bruno needs a David

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Law voice note. Yes. Don't

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54:10

Hello to our mascots, I of

54:12

course have the dearly departed Darwin,

54:14

David with Francis and Matt with

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Ilana Kloss. We have our top

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54:25

Jamie and Geoff and Matt. We

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have shout outs. We do and I was

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just gonna say we heard Billy Jean King's voice

54:32

didn't we? On the way to the US

54:35

Open today we had to take a

54:37

slightly strange route because the seven

54:40

train was not running half

54:42

way so we had to... Yeah, it was circuitous.

54:44

Yeah. Yeah and we

54:47

heard Billy Jean King's voice on the subway.

54:49

She gave us some instructions which we were

54:51

very grateful for. Which was very

54:53

cool. But yes

54:55

shout outs. We start today

54:57

with Anne Fitzpatrick

55:01

in Dublin. Isn't there

55:03

a tennis player

55:05

called Anne Fitzpatrick? Anna Fitzpatrick.

55:08

Pretty close. Yeah, that's right.

55:10

And she was a Wimbledon

55:12

junior finalist I think many

55:16

years ago. I know her a little bit. And

55:19

this Anne is from

55:21

Dublin and we met

55:23

at the French Open this year.

55:26

She came over just before

55:30

we were about to record or just

55:33

after we'd finished recording and we had

55:35

a lovely chat and she was a

55:37

good time. Anne, that's

55:40

what I can tell you. Marvelous. She

55:42

took a photo with us. Oh my gosh

55:44

I'm remembering now. Yeah. She held

55:46

the mic. It was great.

55:49

We had a lovely chat

55:51

with Anne. And with

55:53

an E. Same church, different puke.

55:55

Like Anne Kjothavong. No,

55:58

yes Anne Kjothavong has an E. Yeah.

56:01

Thank you, Anne. We've

56:04

also got Brian Terry. Hello,

56:07

Brian. Hello, Brian. Brian lives in

56:09

Queens, New York. Aww! And

56:12

Brian has written such

56:15

a lovely message, which I

56:17

won't read out on the

56:20

pod because it's far too self-indulgent.

56:22

But Brian... Oh, don't stop yourself. Please,

56:24

well, please know that we've read

56:26

and seen and greatly appreciated

56:28

your very kind words. And we

56:31

know that you're a very loyal

56:33

listener. Aww! And he says, See you

56:35

in Flushing Meadows. So hopefully we will

56:37

over the next couple of weeks. I mean,

56:40

he could be in our midst right now. Great

56:42

news! Love that. Brian with an I or a

56:44

Y? With a Y.

56:47

Like Brian Shelton. Yes. Father of

56:49

Ben. And the Brian's.

56:53

Yes. Yeah.

56:57

Big deal around these parts. Thank

56:59

you, Brian. Thanks, Brian. Hope to see you

57:02

over the next two weeks. That'd be very

57:04

cool. And finally,

57:06

we've got Tommy Gibson in

57:08

Florida. Right, Tommy. Hello, Tommy.

57:11

Like Tommy Paul. He's also in

57:13

Florida. Yeah. Tommy

57:16

says, I'm a lifelong tennis fan.

57:19

I worked for USTA Player Development

57:21

in the 90s, David. Now

57:24

we're talking. He says he's a

57:26

jubilant Al Kharaz fan, a

57:28

suffering fan of Caroline Garcia. Oh, no.

57:30

Like a dad. And a new fan

57:32

of the pod. That's

57:35

dad is very into Caroline Garcia. Well,

57:37

you're very welcome to be with us,

57:39

Tommy. Thank you. So

57:43

if you worked for USTA Player Development in

57:45

the 90s, what players might

57:47

you have been responsible for developing? Andy

57:49

Roddick? Yeah.

57:52

Mardi Fish. That sort of generation. Andy

57:55

Roddick is very keen

57:57

to talk about how... wasn't

58:00

part of the USTA development

58:02

and he did it all himself.

58:07

But yes. Robbie Jeanette Pree? Yes,

58:09

very good. Thank you. James

58:12

Blake? Tommy, let us know

58:14

if you had a hand in the development of any

58:16

of these not

58:19

quite Grand Slam winning American tennis players.

58:23

Tommy, Anne and Brian, thank

58:26

you very much. Thanks to all of our

58:28

friends of the Tennis Podcast. It is because

58:30

of you that we are here and we

58:33

are loving being here on this beautiful New

58:36

York evening. We have one more preview

58:38

show to come before things kick off

58:40

on Monday. That show is at

58:42

3 p.m. local time here in New

58:44

York on Sunday. That is 8

58:46

p.m. in the UK

58:49

and midday on

58:51

the west coast of the US. Correct.

58:53

Nailed it. And

58:56

that would be sort of morning

58:58

time in Australia. 5 a.m. Melbourne.

59:02

Convenient. Convenient.

59:05

And that's the most convenient

59:07

Australian time. Yeah. Look, it'll

59:09

be available as a podcast as usual

59:11

and it'll stay up on YouTube if

59:13

you want to watch non-live if it

59:16

doesn't occur in a time zone that

59:18

is convenient for you. So we do

59:21

hope to see as many of you there

59:23

live as possible. It would be great to

59:25

see you. We'll have Hannah in the chat

59:27

and we'll be taking questions about the upcoming

59:30

US Open. We can't wait. We will

59:32

see you tomorrow at 3 p.m.

59:35

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